This file is one of the Wolfstone archives of the Halloween mailing lists. You can find out more, and reach the entire collection here: http://www.pobox.com/~wolfstone/_r/HalloweenArchive.html This particular archive deals with "audio technology" topics. This includes: o technology of sound o amplifiers o speakers It does NOT include related topics: o music o interesting sound tracks - - - - - Date: Wed, 25 Mar 1998 13:15:22 -0800 Subject: HALL: Amplifiers From: brotherfear at juno.com (David C Schwend) Getting the most watts for your dollar is the trick when purchasing "pro" amplifiers. I have purchased three stereo amplifiers from Carvin that I've been very happy with. I use them for haunting, and for live sound reinforcement at concerts, plays, and special events. The audio is clean (no buzzes, hums, pops, or clicks) and undistorted. Lots of "pro" features like separate volume controls, banana jacks, speak-on connectors, rack mountable chassis, and balanced low impedance inputs. In the watts per dollar category it was the best I found among brands with similar specs. Their web site is http://www.carvin.com/ They are local to Southern California, with their factory in Escondido (North San Diego County). They have stores in Hollywood, Covina, Escondido, and Santa Ana, California. They also manufacture guitars and a number musical instrument amps, about which I know very little. Some of their other pro-gear looks pretty good. I wasn't to impressed with their mixer designs though. If you get into one of their demo rooms, be aware that whoever set them up hasn't done them any favors. I been to them all and each demo system had a very nasty 60 cycle hum. There's a ground loop somewhere. The amps are not the problem, in my experience. - - - - - Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 11:40:25 -0400 From: GibBster Subject: Re: HALL: jack o lantern of all trades... You, for sure, do NOT want to hook up that many speakers in series, because everytime you connect an inductive load like that the impedance drops to half or below the lowest single impedance. For example, two 8 ohm speakers connected in parallel (usually called "daisy chained" )would yield an overall impedance of 4 ohms.While many amplifiers can handle this, many cannot, and going any lower decreases the impedance further, to the point where you may as well have a full blown short on the output as far as the amp is concerned. Four 8 ohm speakers gives you only 2 ohms for example, and this fries most amplifiers immediately. You can be creative, however, in rigging up a series/parallel combination. Put two 16 ohm speakers in parallel, but link two 4 ohm speakers in series. This gives you 8 ohms either way. Try to keep the 8 ohm speakers separate if you can. If you have four 8 ohm speakers, you could link two pairs of speakers hooked in parallel in series, which would bring you back to 8 ohms!! See below for clarification of that confusing bit of nonsense :-) Series Series 8 8 | | | --parallel-- | = 8 ohms | | 8 8 __ __ 16ohms 16 ohms - - - - - Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 13:46:03 -0400 From: GibBster Subject: Re: HALL: jack o lantern of all trades... And yes, resistance (impedance too) in parallel halfs....resistance hooked up in series doubles. Just FYI, The difference between resistance and impedance is that resistance really only refers to a DC voltage, whereas impedance takes into account "AC resistance", which can vary with the frequency depending on the circuit design. This is because capacitors and coils have an effect on AC circuits that can changes with the frequency of the AC signal. Raise the freq in a capacitive circuit, the impedance drops. The opposite is true in a purely inductive circuit. So in this case, Impedance is the factor you want to look at because you're talking about audio signals which are AC. 'kay? But don't sweat the details, just watch out that your overall impedance doesn't dip too low. If this amp is stereo, you'd pretty much want both left and right channels to have the same impedance .Other than that, You can mix your impedances so long as they don't dip below the rated level as per your mfg specs. Too high of an impedance will kill off your volume. - - - - - From: mrscary at kiva.net Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 13:30:59 -0500 Subject: Re: HALL: jack o lantern of all trades... Snip >You could use a 70v system but you would need a 70v Amplifier as well... >You could then get transformers matched to each speaker... Usually a 70v >system is used when you want to go long distances (hundreds of feet) >with sound. You can use a 70v transformer with the amp you are using.... (Radio Shack: 70v/100w transformer RSU 10436475 $49.99. Line transformer: 32-1031 $5.99) You can convert your AMP into a 70v system this way. :) ***Be careful and keep things cool, and don't over-drive the system.*** While at RadShac Pick up a book "How to build Sound systems" it will show you how.... Or better yet, Pick up JB Corns book 1. (www.btprod.com) It also shows you how. 70v systems are easy to use. I'm converting our place over to it next season since the layout will be changed (I keep saying that don't I?). 70v systems are great when several speakers are needed with a single amp. (i.e. club, hotel, office, etc) - - - - - Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 12:40:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Dave Bell Subject: Re: HALL: jack o lantern of all trades... On Sun, 16 Aug 1998 Spookyfx at aol.com wrote: > > You, for sure, do NOT want to hook up that many speakers in series, because > > everytime you connect an inductive load like that the impedance drops to > > half or > > below the lowest single impedance. For example, two 8 ohm speakers > connected in parallel........(snip) > > Ok Now I am confused. > Which one do you mean? > is it SERIES or PARALLEL? > What happens if you connect the speakers in SERIES? > The resistance will be combined as I said right? NO? Boy - this is getting thick! I'll try to summarize, as there have been some good basic ideas mentioned. Hooking speakers in series gives the result of the SUM of their individual impedance ratings. (8 Ohms seriesed with 8 Ohms = 16 Ohms) Hooking them in parallel gives the the sum of the RECIPROCALS of their individual impedances: 1/8 Ohms + 1/8 Ohms = 2/8. 1/(2/8) = 4 Ohms. More complex: 1/8 Ohms + 1/16 Ohms = 3/16. 1/(3/16) = 5.33 Ohms. It is NOT a good idea to connect speakers of different impedances in SERIES. The problem is that the available power divides very unequally across the different speakers. It's OK to wire two or more of the SAME impedance in series, though. Actually, you want to match speakers wired in parallel, also. This requirement is where the 70.7 Volt transformer idea comes into play, commercially. More later... Now, combining operations: Let's say you have a mixed bag of 4 each 4-Ohm speakers, 4 8-Ohms, and a 16-Ohm. First, wire the 4 4-Ohm units in series. This gives you a string that equals 16 Ohms. Next, wire the 2 8-Ohms in series, also yielding 16 Ohms. Now, wire the two strings in parallel with the single 16-Ohm speaker, for a net of 16/3 = 5.33 Ohms. You could hook that to either the 4-Ohm or 8-Ohm tap on your amplifier safely. That's all OK, but the problem is that the audio power supplied to the various speakers isn't all the same. If you crank the amplifier up to say, 24 Watts, that power divides equally across the three 16-Ohm branches. Thus, the single 16-Ohm gets 8 Watts, each of the 8-Ohm gets 4 Watts (8 in the *branch*), and each of the 4-Ohm gets 2 Watts. Maybe that's what you want, but it's hard to determine and set up for what you need. Here's where the transformers come in. They were designed to have a higher voltage (thus lower current) signal on the distribution line than normal low-impedance speakers. This lets you use smaller wire for longer runs, without dropping power along the way. The system is set up for a *nominal* 70.7 Volts RMS at max power. Since power, voltage and impedance are related, this implies a certain line impedance for a given max power. You don't need to worry too much about this, because the whole thing is designed to make it easy to mix speakers and power level at each speaker, all on a single system. First, you get a 70 V transformer for your amplifier. Pick one rated for the approximate maximum power out of your amp. Maybe 25, 50, or 100 Watts. One winding will be labelled "Line - 70.7 V", and the other may have several taps for 4, 8, 16 Ohms. Select one set and wire it to the *same* impedance tap on your amplifier output. If your amp has only a single set of terminals, labelled for say, 8 Ohms, wire them to the 8-Ohm taps on the transformer. Now, run the "Line" side out to your wiring, all over the set. At each spot you want a speaker, first decide how much of that 50 Watts (or whatever) you want to go to *that* speaker. Then install a transformer rated at that level, say 5 Watts, with it's "Line" winding across the distribution wires. Hook your speaker to the 4, 8, or 16-Ohm winding or taps on the other side of the transformer. (Sometimes these come with a tapped Line side, with the taps labelled in Watts: 2.5, 5, 10 Watts, for example.) This way, each speaker is properly matched to the line, and gets power proportionately to how you select the transformer and taps. One more mod: If you want say two speakers at a location, you can wire them in series or parallel (if they are the same impedance) and hook them to one transformer. Just select the speaker tap that matches the *combined* impedance of the speakers you use. Then, *each* speaker will get *half* of the transformer-selected Watts... - - - - - Date: Sun, 16 Aug 1998 17:05:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Dave Bell Subject: HALL: Speaker in the Home Haunt OK, guys 'n' ghouls, Jerry shamed me into spending a little while and writing up my "speakers" posting a little more fully, and adding some visual aids. I did a little digging, and found some text already to add into the document, so it all took less time then I thought! Browse on over to: http://www.TheBells.net/Speakers.html Any corrections gladly accepted... (Incorporating them may take longer!) - - - - - From: DonJohn002 at aol.com Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1998 00:11:40 EDT Subject: Re: HALL: jack o lantern of all trades... Hi ! I run a HH for my kid's school. We gross $20,000 in 2 nights - about 2/3rds go back to the schools (we run in concert with 2 other schools; just added the third last year. 2 schools get most of the net and the third gets 10%) We have priced everything so that we average about $8 a guest. We have videos running in the line, run a cafeteria, sell novelties as well as the main attraction. It fills about 3,000 sq. feet with about 25 scenes and close to 100 actors. Anyway, back to the sound system. I have a background in technical theater - when I took over, we were running 12 or so borrowed speakers wired in parallel to a boom box ! And they were complaining there wasn't enough volume; it was a miracle the boom box survived. Assuming an equal distribution between the left and right channels and taking into account the resistance of the long wire runs - we were lucky to have 2 ohms impedance. The first item I took care of was to purchase matching speakers. As important as the impedance is the load or wattage rating. Given two speakers, one rated 100 wats and the second rated 25 watts, one will et too much power and might blow while the other will not produce enough volume. So I took 6 speakers rated 40 watts and wired them in three parallel sets of two in series. The 2 in series gave me 16 ohms and then wiring 3 sets in parallel gave me 5.3 ohms (16 / 3 = 5.33) Including wire resistance, I am still in the 4-8 ohm range... 2 sets (1 per stereo channel) of 6 (2x3) give me 12 speakers... Now as to the wattage, 40 watts x 6 speakers = 240 watts. You want the speakers to be rated 50%-80% of your amplifiers rated output; I use a 1200 watt Peavey amplifier (600 watts per channel) to drive my system. Plenty of power! That's the main problem I've seen in HH sound systems - the amp just doesn't have enough juice! Your home stereo amp won't cut it for more than 4 speakers. I first got my amp from a local dj who did a lot of charity work for the town... It was good for his business and good for ours. Recently I got the ok to buy a professional quality sound system for our school and that's how I got the BIG amp :-) - - - - - Date: Mon, 17 Aug 1998 20:27:00 -0500 From: JB Corn Subject: Re: HALL: speaker Hi all, time to chime in on tis speaker thing. Impedance shmedance. Pop, what pop? First, 70 volt sound is the best way to go. Castle Dragon has 18 speakers distributed for house sound, total 100 watts, and the sound fills the place the speakers are 5 and 10 watts. Individual rooms have stereo sound tracks and speakers 8 ohm, effects have sound tracks 5 to 20 watts 8 to 16 ohms, the amp feeds a like resistor when not feeding the speaker. That takes care of the pop. But the best way is to have the sound effect start off with a bang, kinds need that to get their attention, lol. - - - - - Date: Tue, 18 Aug 1998 09:57:33 -0700 Subject: HALL: Haunted House Sound Systems From: brotherfear at juno.com (Brother Fear) Status: O I was going to try and write an article on Haunted House Sound Systems, until I discovered Cliff Martin had already written a wonderful article for HAPA. It is a great guide for starting to understand the intricacies of sound systems and many of the dos and don'ts of good sound at a haunted event. He even explains the SERIES/PARALLEL speaker connection techniques with diagrams. Maybe Evil Doc Stu still has a few copies, or perhaps the author himself will post it on his web site. Good job Cliff! - - - - - Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 13:34:27 -0700 (PDT) From: d g Subject: Re: HALL: Sound chips at RadioShack Ok I guess I'll toss my two cents worth in. The ISD single voice recorder chips from Jameco do have AGC on the pre amp. However they allow you to input a signal directly to the amp (the ANA IN pin) thus bypassing the pre amp and the AGC circuit. I've had good luck programming this chip using the line out jack from my laptop going into the ANA IN pin through a 0.1uf cap. The output is designed to drive a speaker directly, but it's also designed so you can cascade the outputs of several devices, so you should be able to run that output (the SP+ pin)into any amp you want to. I haven't done this, but it should work. - - - - - Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 15:02:43 -0700 (PDT) From: d g Subject: HALL: ISD voice recorder chip circuit Hi all I went ahead and put up a page with the circuit I'm using for the ISD-2590 voice recorder chip. http://members.theglobe.com/migizi1/default.htm You can get these chips from Jameco for $12.95. http://www.jameco.com/ Anyone who uses it please let me know how it works out. If I get enough interest I'll add other circuits that would be useful. - - - - - Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 15:59:38 -0700 (PDT) From: d g Subject: Re: HALL: ISD voice recorder chip circuit --- Jerry Chavez wrote: > Hi all > > I went ahead and put up a page with the circuit I'm > using for the ISD-2590 voice recorder chip. > > > Will your circuit by pass the AGC? > > Thanks > jerry ^v^ Yes it will. The AGC is only in the pre amp, and my circuit bypasses that. The chip will drive a speaker directly, but the volume is kind of low for what most of us want to do. The data book has a circuit in it for an external amplifier for the output. I'll put that one up next. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Mic to line level conversion From: "Malcolm Little" Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 15:48:50 -0400 Bob, I usually just use a small audio transformer to change from a low impedence signal to a high. This works great for sending speaker output to mike input, should be able to use one for mike to line. -Malcolm > Which is the higher voltage, mic or line level stuff? I'm > bypassing an electret > microphone from a chipcorder that I need to make into a > line-level type input. > Any ideas? It's the same one found on Jim Kadel's page. - - - - - Subject: Re: Howl - Voice chip product? From: "Sweet Screams" Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:42:57 -0400 Sorry. I know of one but it's not cheap. It's a device that allows you to record either with the built-in mic or with a line in. It can be activated manually or by it's IR sensor. One variety of this device is called a Super Seller (because, apparently, it was originally designed for retail and safety uses.) I used this little device in my set last year. I recorded some of the sounds from Alien directly into the device then plugged some computer speakers into it and let her rip on the set. As people walked in, they tripped the IR sensor and the recording would activate. As the haunt was not continuously busy, this helped serve as a warning for the pop-outs who couldn't see people coming. The device and the computer speakers ran = on batteries which made it real convenient. The downside is, I believe the Super Seller sells for $200. Spooky F/X also sells a version for $100. http://members.aol.com/spookyfx/index.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Philmon" To: "HOWL2000 Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2000 9:04 AM Subject: Howl - Voice chip product? > I'd like to buy a simple and cheap voice chip device for scare effects. > Requirements: about 20 seconds digital recording, low power DC = operation, > mic in and audio out connections, triggered by simple normally open switch. > > Seems this should be available somewhere, right? I believe I could make one > using the available voice chips, but would rather just buy it. - - - - - Subject: Re: Howl - x2 Voice chip product? From: Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 09:23:24 -0500 At 09:04 AM 08/16/2000 -0400, you wrote: >I'd like to buy a simple and cheap voice chip device for scare effects. >Requirements: about 20 seconds digital recording, low power DC = operation, >mic in and audio out connections, triggered by simple normally open = switch. Sorry all, there wasn't a link. I wrote: Radio Shack part number- 276-1326 20 seconds for 20 bucks. The record/playback switches, mic and speaker are all on pigtails so it's easy to work with and modify. Denny PS. For more time, quality and money ($109.95) click on the link below. Quantities of the TerrorCord are very limited this year. B.T. Productions' Terror By Design Scare Wares & Supplies to Haunt Your House What's New?- - - - - - Subject: Re: Howl - Voice chip product? From: "Jim Kadel" Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 11:07:30 -0400 Try Radio-Shack they have two one sells for $ 10. and the other for $ 20. Definately purchase the $ 20.00 for what you describe. - - - - - Subject: Re: Howl - Voice chip product? From: "Edwin Wise" Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 13:08:10 -0500 On 8/16/00, at 9:04 AM, Greg Philmon wrote: >I'd like to buy a simple and cheap voice chip device for scare effects. >Requirements: about 20 seconds digital recording, low power DC = operation, >mic in and audio out connections, triggered by simple normally open switch. > >Seems this should be available somewhere, right? I believe I could make one >using the available voice chips, but would rather just buy it. > >Can anyone point me to a source? Thanks in advance. The Scare Factory sells one. Denny (Terror by Design) has one designed, = but is having trouble getting parts; his will be available by next season. I'm designing one that should be even better... but it won't be available until next season (it's going through testing at a haunt this year to make sure it's solid). - - - - - Subject: Voice chip product From: Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2000 20:39:00 EDT In a message dated 8/16/00 6:55:42 AM Pacific Daylight Time, urieldewolf at prodigy.net writes: > who couldn't see people coming. The device and the computer speakers = ran on > batteries which made it real convenient. The downside is, I believe = the > Super Seller sells for $200. Spooky F/X also sells a version for $100. > http://members.aol.com/spookyfx/index.html > > > Abby Normal > Thanks for mentioning my product Abby. My play back units have a tape player adapter for its output. The idea was to make it covenant for the Home Haunter that has already invested $$$ in several boom boxes or even expensive stereo systems players for there HH. This way you could add the voice chip technology to your existing equipment. Basically upgrading your present sound system. However I can customize any unit for you to provide you with speaker level output instead of the tape player adapter. Thanks Jerry ^v^ Spooky F/X webpage http://members.aol.com/spookyfx/index.html - - - - - Subject: Re: Speakers From: "Tim D" Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 18:27:14 -0800 I do not believe it is possible to tell the wattage rating of an unmarked speaker without some sophisticated equipment. Three issues come into play: 1. Short term current capacity (determined primarily by the gauge of the coil wire) 2. Long term heat dissipation (determined by the mechanical = characteristics of the voice coil and magnet structure) 3. Excursion (overdriving a speaker can cause the voice coil to hit or become dislodged from the structure) #1 would be difficult to measure without knowing the length of the coil wire, and even then... #3 can usually be heard as the limit is reached (distortions in low-frequency sine wave) #2 would require much testing and careful measuring to determine if the energy being wasted in the speaker is being effectively dissipated. Of course, none of this would be of any significance to the amplifier.Ê = The amplifier is just looking for a minimum load impedence to prevent driving excessive current.Ê The impedence of the speaker can be estimated by ohm-meter measurement.Ê The DC resistance of a speaker is usually about 25-40% lower than the rated impedence. -Tim visit www.hauntinggrounds.org "Nostre Spectaculum Faeculentus" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Karl Fields" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2001 4:10 PM Subject: Hall: Speakers > In my quest to not fry any more amplifiers this year, does anyone know = how > to figure wattage of an unmarked speaker? - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Re: Speakers From: "Jim Kadel" Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 23:17:30 -0500 Karl, Seems to me, you'd be OK with the situation you describe. It can't hurt the amp to have greater wattage of speakers connected. Once the amp is pumping out 100 watts, its maximum,Ê the speakers won't be fully powered but that doesn't hurt anything. It's the other way around that would "cause hurt" and that would be to the = speakers. (ie if you had 50 watt speakers on a 100 watt amp - speakers get damaged = with over powering) - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Re: Speakers From: "Rob Withoff" Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 23:10:54 -0600 +--------------------------------------------------------------------------= + | Rob Withoff, Big KahunaÊÊÊÊÊÊÊÊÊÊÊÊÊ Sound, Vision, and Digitalia | Magic Marmot Studios | http://www.magic-marmot.com +--------------------------------------------------------------------------= + > I have a question for the list....is the ohmage of a speaker just > resistive or does it indicate impedance at some frequency and if so, = what frequency > would that be? Impedance, not resistance, and it's generally a guess based on a = particular design, not really measured. The impedance is an average across the = 20-20kHz spectrum, more or less. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Re: Speakers From: "Rob Withoff" Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2001 23:10:52 -0600 Karl-- In general, a speaker's wattage rating is the MAXIMUM power it can take. Your amplifier at 100 watts will run a speaker rated at 400 fine. However, you want to wire the speakers in paralell, not series. Audio amplifiers = are current amplifiers, and are designed for low-impedance loads. If you are running a lot of speakers, you might want to consider getting a line transformer. They are designed for PA systems running lots of = speakers, and will distribute the load evenly. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Re: Speakers From: "Malcolm Little" Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 00:13:34 -0500 Gotta go with Tim here. The "Ohm" rating is a nominal impedence (sorta like an AC resistance) rating, and is derrived by the manufacturer at some particular frequency. The impedance will vary with the frequency, and there is not necesarily even a standard rating scheme among manufacturers. Wattage ratings show how much power the speaker can dissipate. You need them to be able to handle everything that you are going to drive into them, and about the only way to know without some markings is to guess based upon size/shape/magnet/coin flip/moon phase. While there ARE instruments and methods to measure these specs, new speakers are cheaper. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Re: Speakers From: "Robert Benfield" Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 00:28:19 -0500 The clipping of an underpowered amp blows more speakers than an = overpowered amp, as it doesn't clip so easily. -----Original Message----- From: Jim Kadel (ie if you had 50 watt speakers on a 100 watt amp - speakers get damaged with over powering) - - - - - Subject: Speakers / Amplifiers From: "Robert Benfield" Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 12:56:25 -0500 Now that I have more time to write, I will. Use the largest powered amplifier your budget allows.Ê This isn't for loudness either.Ê Some people think a 100 watt amp is twice as loud as a = 50 watt amp.Ê This just isn't the case.Ê It takes 10 times as many watts to double the sound level.Ê So a 500 watt amp is twice as loud as a 50 watt amp, and a 5000 watt amp is twice as loud as the 500 watt amp, and so on. The largest single cause of speaker "blows" is the high frequencies = produced by an amplifier when it is driven into clipping.Ê When the signal is = clipped the result resembles a squarewave.Ê Driving an amp into clipping looks pretty cool on an o'scope too.Ê A square wave contains high frequency harmonics at a larger level then most audio signals would have.Ê This of course is transmitted to your speakers, which aren't designed to handle = high frequency like this, this effectively turns your speaker coils into a car cigarette lighter and the coils get burned out. *POOF*Ê This isn't to say your speakers willÊ cease to operate.Ê They almost have to ignite into a fire to do this, but it will degrade the quality severely!Ê You've heard this in cars, I'm sure. Clipping is caused by you turning up the volume on an underpowered amp because it's not loud enough.Ê This is why 99% of car speakers are blown within 3 minutes of driving it off the dealers lot. As the signal approaches this clipping level, even during transients, the distortion level rises a whole bunch, and the damping drops like a brick. So, you want to keep it out of this area.Ê How?Ê You need to have an amp that matches the power rating of your speaker, but much much much better = is to have an amp that exceeds the power rating of your speakers.Ê Don't be concerned about blowing your speakers out with a higher rated amp.Ê This just does not happen, unless the operator is an idiot (and I use that term lightly)Ê You'd have to turn the volume up way too loud and actually push the coil out of the permanent magnet.Ê Remember, a speaker is nothing more than a linear motor. This, of course is my opinion, derived from years in classrooms and labs playing with amps, from simple one stage amps, up to RADAR systems, which = is what I was trained in.Ê Gotta learn the basics before playing with RADAR. But if you ask Henry Kloss about this, he'll agree with my opinion.Ê :) - - - - - Subject: Speakers, speaking of From: "Carl Cowley" Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 21:09:54 -0800 Just something to throw out to the group.Ê If you are looking at running a bunch of speakers, up to 16 pairs per amplifier, and you don't want to = have to worry about the impedence seen by the amplifer, then you can use impedence matching volume controls.Ê These controls are not too expensive (around $20 - $25) and allow you to wire all the speaker pairs in parallel with a volume control for each set.Ê The amplifier will always see between 4-8 ohms.Ê It is just an alternative to a 70V line system, but it works = very well.Ê They can be purchased from places like MCM Electronics www.mcm.com = or Parts Express www.partsexpress.com . - - - - - Subject: RE: Howl - An interesting site... From: "Jeff Brown" Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2001 21:14:18 -0700 At 10:28 PM 04/09/2001 -0500, you wrote: >Do you have this guys web site and not the company that set him up's web >site? I don't know that he has a web site. The referring company, Stage = Research, showcases some of their clients. They make a great little product called SFX, which lets you set up all your sound cues and run them exactly like a = light board with a GO button (that's theatre speak, folks). A great little = product, a little pricey, and not really much good for our use. I used it to run all the sound effects and background music for the Nickelodeon = shows at the Paramount Parks (like 130 cues). In a show like that, where everything is bang, bang, bang it was priceless. There is a free 30-day demo on their site, www.stageresearch.com. It's fun = to play around with. Professor Time (aka Jeff Brown) Professor Time's Nightmare University www.timepasses.com - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Re: Re: Re: Terror Tones CD From: "Rob Withoff" Date: Thu, 2 Aug 2001 17:50:46 -0500 +--------------------------------------------------------- | Rob Withoff http://www.magic-marmot.com | Big Kahuna | Magic Marmot Studios Sound, Vision, and Digitalia +--------------------------------------------------------- > On some of the first CDs I burned at home, I had this problem > as well. The pops are introduced as the CD is burned. The way > it was explained to me, they are caused by the burning laser > turning on and turning off between tracks. > This is one way that clicks & pops get introduced. Another one is DC = offeet, either in the file or on the card. Using disc-at-once to burn is always a good idea for audio CD's, but whenever you burn an audio CD, you should *always* do a little premastering, minimally fading in and fading out tracks. - - - - - Subject: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "Kim & Vince" Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 18:17:19 -0400 (Triggering a CD player) My approach, for the coming year, is to approach the problem by triggering = a different part of the system. I plan to have any CDs I use running continuously, with their output sent through either flea market computer speakers, or our trash-picked stereo receivers. It will be the speakers, or the receiver sending the signal to normal speakers, that get "triggered". This reduces the amount of constant power needed, and leaves your sound running constantly. As for triggering the speakers, or receiver? I also plan to take the easy way out for that, too. When the motion detcetor floodlight housings go on sale at K-Mart again, I'll be buying 5-10 of them. Then, you take a simple screw-in adapter, for standard light sockets, and plug any TWO-PRONG appliance or equipment into it. You can even plug a TWO-PRONG extension = cord into. PLEASE DO NOT use three prong equipment, outisde, if you are not plugging it into a THREE PRONG receptacle (steps down off soap box). When the motion detector "sees" someone, your speakers, or receiver, will turn on, and play the signal that your sound source has been putting out. This way, you don't put as high a load on your circuit breaker, etc. (our CD = was playing at half speed last year due to power issues). If yo don't quite get my drift, let me know, and I can try to explain better, or (remotely possible) put an explanation on my website. But, it = is a quick way to get motion detection triggering, safely, for the electronically UNinclined. - - - - - Subject: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "WebMistress" Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 19:22:37 -0700 (PDT) This sounds interesting. So the stero is aways on sending the signal ... = but you trigger the speaker power? What are you using? All I can = invistion is a pair of computer speakers that have to be plugged into a = power source and a motion dector that controls the power. Webby --- "Kim & Vince" > wrote: >(Triggering a CD player) > >My approach, for the coming year, is to approach the problem by = triggering a >different part of the system. >I plan to have any CDs I use running continuously, with their output sent >through either flea market computer speakers, or our trash-picked stereo >receivers. It will be the speakers, or the receiver sending the signal to >normal speakers, that get "triggered". This reduces the amount of = constant >power needed, and leaves your sound running constantly. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "Pirates of Emerson" Date: Sat, 04 Aug 2001 19:44:39 -0700 I used to do something like that, used a relay to close the current loop = to the speaker. Problem I couldn't overcome was the 'pop' sound when the speaker was triggered back on with a high volume level. Speaking of 'pop', I used the Terror Tone CD in Pirates last year and = don't remember hearing that. I used track one on continuous play. Was it effective? Hard to tell. One of my problems in finding out was I = had it in an area that would have been remembered well anyway, the Vortex tunnel, so any question put to exiting customers about the area was always 'way kewl tunnel' nothing about the sound effect. This year I am moving it to one of the dark winding hallways with nothing much happening in it. Should produce a better questionnaire result. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "DWM Productions" Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 21:41:09 -0700 (PDT) what you can do is use the same relay or a timer and you turn on and off the cd going to your amplifier not turning on and off the speakers because the speaker wire is carrying a load, and when you turn off and on the speakers it will start to overheat the amp. Do the same thing but leave the amp on all the time and use the timer between the cd player and the amp. They way I did it is I cut the rca wires in half and used a timer between the two cut pieces of rca cable. Play the cd all the time with the specific sound you want over and over and let the timer turn on and off the signal from the cd output to the input of the amp. Hope this works. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "Pirates of Emerson" Date: Sat, 04 Aug 2001 22:22:07 -0700 (If you were responding to my post) That's good David, however in my case it's not actually a long sound, but a sudden sound - say like a cannon = being fired. I lied a little too, these sounds are not CD but .VOC files through = a SoundBlaster through the amp. BTW - What would I want 500 free banners ads for? Karl -----Original Message----- Behalf Of DWM Productions Subject: RE: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) Do the same thing but leave the amp on all the time and use the timer between the cd player and the amp. David at fogmachines.com To get 500 free banner ads go to - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "DWM Productions" Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 03:13:04 -0700 (PDT) yep i was responding to your post, you shouldn't lie. lol. Just use Universal dual timer and you can program it to blast a half second or so. I finally found a way to trigger a cd for my purpose. as for 500 free ads, it's free, who cares. lol. Want to buy my trailer of goodies Karl? - - - - - Subject: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player & other mediums From: "The Wonderer" Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 10:30:11 -0400 what about using a computer for sound affects. Perhaps tied to x10 motion = sensors and a x10 receiver on the computer? I was just planning on using the x10 motion sensors at the street already = to apply power to a extra car stereo. I know if cassette is installed it = starts playing and switch's directions automaticly. anyone with a car CD player know if the CD auto plays apon car ignition = ON? If I'm correct there are two 12v inputs. One for clock, pwr and one to indicate ingination switch is turned ON. I would think if one just = applies the 12v to the ON side would be instant on almost. Using a x10 power or relay module. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "WebMistress" Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 07:49:04 -0700 (PDT) I was thinking about using my SoundBlaster Pro in my haunt to control = sounds in a few areas. It has RCA jacks instead of the normal ones .. so = I can leave it in the house and run long lengths of cable out to my = speakers. And I also want a sudden sound, so the crack of the speaker = wouldn't bother me (I think). Karl, why do you use .voc, instead of .wav or .mp3? Webby Ps ... Karl you want 500 banners so you make a caccon banner man hanging = over your lagoon :) --- Pirates of Emerson > wrote: >(If you were responding to my post) That's good David, however in my case >it's not actually a long sound, but a sudden sound - say like a cannon = being >fired. I lied a little too, these sounds are not CD but .VOC files = through a >SoundBlaster through the amp. - - - - - Subject: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player & other mediums From: "WebMistress" Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 07:58:41 -0700 (PDT) My CD player in my Truck starts the tracks in the same spot when the = palyer is turned off, my hubbies starts on cd1-track1 everytime. But both of our players bypass the igition switch and can be left on all = the time. So I'm not sure on the autostart up. But a few have auto place holders :) Webby --- The Wonderer >anyone with a car CD player know if the CD auto plays apon car ignition = ON? > >If I'm correct there are two 12v inputs. One for clock, pwr and one to >indicate ingination switch is turned ON. I would think if one just = applies >the 12v to the ON side would be instant on almost. Using a x10 power or >relay module. - - - - - Subject: RE: Hall: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A N From: "Rob Withoff" Date: Mon, 6 Aug 2001 01:53:15 -0500 > I wouldn't be surprised if you can hook an $1.50 infrared LED directly = up > to the stamp and generate the appropriate sequence of pulses to control > the CD player. I'll do some more digging myself. I remember a universal-remote project on CircuitCellar.com several years back. I don't know if the control codes would be the same or not. I do know that IR modules are available (RadioShack and Digi-Key have = 'em). It's not just an IR LED, it's a modulated carrier. Don't know the actual codes, but if you had some time, you could decode = the remote that came *with* the CD player. Hacking an existing remote is a cheaper and quicker solution, at the expense of elegance. I'm thinking that the delay for starting the CD track might be a problem, unless you wrote the code to preset it to a particular track each time. If you wanted to do someting more interactive, there would be time searching between tracks. That's why I was thinking of a similar hack to one of = those nifty MP3 players. You could preload a bunch of different audio clips, and with some clever programming, you could have a cool interactive-type show, like maybe a gypsy fortune teller, or a seance. Or in a given scene, you could have an animatronic character react differently depending on different triggers in the scene. Oh, I feel the drawing board calling my name again... - - - - - Subject: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player & other mediums From: "James Maguire" Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 17:21:52 -0400 The factory CD player in the Mrs. Windstar picks up at the exact place it left off at, it doesn't restart the track. As this is the first car I've ever had with a CD player I don't know if this is the norm... Hell I'm = lucky enough to have FM in my car. Phobos >From: The Wonderer >Reply-To: "Halloween List" >To: "Halloween List" >Subject: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player & other mediums >Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 10:30:11 -0400 > >what about using a computer for sound affects. Perhaps tied to x10 = motion >sensors and a x10 receiver on the computer? > >I was just planning on using the x10 motion sensors at the street already = >to >apply power to a extra car stereo. I know if cassette is installed it >starts >playing and switch's directions automaticly. > >anyone with a car CD player know if the CD auto plays apon car ignition = ON? > >If I'm correct there are two 12v inputs. One for clock, pwr and one to >indicate ingination switch is turned ON. I would think if one just = applies >the 12v to the ON side would be instant on almost. Using a x10 power or >relay module. - - - - - Subject: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "James Maguire" Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 17:25:08 -0400 That's my setup... I used a Harmon-Kardon computer subwoofer system. The power was triggered through an X10 module. It was fine for that setup, but = I wouldn't do that to a high-end system. I'm not really sure what the game plan is this year. I'm using a friends Peavey amp and I don't think he'd appreciate it getting powered on and off at full tilt. Phobos >From: WebMistress >Reply-To: "Halloween List" >To: "Halloween List" >Subject: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New >Beginning)) >Date: Sat, 4 Aug 2001 19:22:37 -0700 (PDT) > >This sounds interesting. So the stero is aways on sending the signal = ... >but you trigger the speaker power? What are you using? All I can >invistion is a pair of computer speakers that have to be plugged into a >power source and a motion dector that controls the power. - - - - - Subject: Re: Hall: Triggering a cheap CD player (Was: TT CD (A New Beginning)) From: "Brent Ross" Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2001 13:30:48 -0700 (PDT) I Personally have multiple cd decks that have cd's with single tracks, = words, crying, screams, etc. Each deck was taken apart and the play = button was rewired to accept an external input(2-24v(depends on the deck)) = which was previously hooked up to a x10 and powerstrip. This year I plan = on hooking it all up to my stamp, which I will hopefully be able to time = the sound to work in sync with the action. Hope this helps Brent P.S. Use a volt meter to test the power used with the switch, dont just = start adding power. - - - - - Subject: Re: Hall: Hiding Things From: "Mouse" Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2001 14:37:05 -0700 well...I guess it kind of depends on what you're wanting to do. You can cover them in leaves and hide them behind a tombstone. In the empty belly of a dummy (leave room in the stuffing to house the speaker). Faux rocks...umm...inside a pumpkin.... Darkness is your best best friend. But do you want to use computer speakers outside? -Mouse At 02:20 PM 08/09/2001 -0700, Robert King wrote: >How can I hide some computer speakers. I just moved into a new house >and we do not have any big shrubs. - - - - - Subject: Re: Hiding Things From: "Tim D" Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2001 20:04:32 -0700 Remember, darkness is our friend. Keep the speakers in as dark an area as possible. Disguise them. Cover them with a black cloth with grass glued all over it. Make a hollow rock to put the speaker in. Put the speaker = in a hole and cover it with mesh and plant material. Hide them inside a = large speaker. "Borrow" some shrubs from Ironman:)) -The Enchanter (There are some who call me... Tim?) visit www.hauntinggrounds.org "Nostre Spectaculum Faeculentus" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert King" To: "Halloween List" Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 2:20 PM Subject: Hall: Hiding Things > How can I hide some computer speakers. I just moved into a new house > and we do not have any big shrubs. - - - - -